Articles
What can I do if I have already been defrauded by a Paintless Dent Repair training school? Can I get any of my money back?
We hear this question all the time. You may be able to get part or all of your money back depending on these factors:
#1 The state where the training school is located. Paintless dent repair training schools are called vocational institutions by most states they are in. In many states there is a government run bureau that will arbitrate between you and the vocational school that gave you poor training. You do not need a lawyer. These bureaus generally favor the student if you have your reciepts, and have any witnesses that were there at the time of your training such as another student that can verify the poor quality of the training. The witness will be interviewed by phone so there is no need to travel. You will be asked to fill out some paperwork, and the whole process can take anywhere from 4 weeks to several months depending on the state.
If the state does have a vocational bureau, and the paintless dent removal training school is not registered with the state, you may be entitled to a full refund of all tuition because the school falied to register with the state, and is conducting an illegal business.
In states where there is no government bureau the chances of getting a refund are poor. Hiring a lawyer can easily exceed the costs of a refund, and the training school counts on this fact.
The best way to determine if your state has such a bureau is to do a google search on "fill in your statevocational education bureau". This should bring up the state agency responsible to help you.
#2 The contract you signed. This of course varies widely. If the school has state approval to operate, the contract will state the specific rights you have. Many contracts contain little about what happens if a student is unhappy about the training afterwards but the state bureau can still help you if you act soon enough.
Many paintless dent repair training schools try and get you to sign something saying you were satisfied with the training, and as you already know you don't really realize you have had bad training untill months after you have been trained. In many states this statement you may have signed means nothing legally and is meant to try and discourage you from sueing after you realize you were taken. Some conditions set forth in the contract with the school may not be binding on you because the conditions of the contract are not applicable in that state.
What you can do to prepare for Paintless Dent Repair training at TopGun
There are several things you can do to prepare for PDR training. But first lets talk about a few things you should NOT do.
# 1 Don't practice! It is ALWAYS easier to train a person that knows nothing about paintless dent repair than to train someone that has practiced on their own. Practicing incorrectly only leads to bad habits. The fewer bad habits you have the quicker you will learn.
If you have already trained at a mill type school, or with a training video, stop practicing and just relax until your training begins with us.
#2 Don't worry. It is my responsibility to teach you paintless dent removal. As long as you have better than average hand eye coordination, good eyesight, and patience, I guarantee you will learn this art.
#3 Don't buy any tools. Even if someone offers you a great deal. Most tools out there are junk, please don't waste your money!
Now for the dos
#1 Get your marketing plan going now. Most techs wait too long to start this most important step. Plan your domain name, website layout, and basic marketing strategy before you train if at all possible. I am always available to help with this, and there is a special section on TopGun to help you prepare your marketing plan. Call me for details.
#2 Exercise and stretch daily. This may seem trivial but it is very important. Most people tire quickly in the forearms, and shoulders when first practicing paintless dent repair. The following exercises will help you to develop the muscles you will need. It isn't necessary to bulk up, or lift heavy weights, just do a moderate amount of these exercises.
Squeezing a rubber ball. Do this for 5-10 minutes a day with each hand.
Wrist curls both front and reverse with a light weight ot barbell
Back Stretches especially for lower and mid back.
Light push ups for shoulder and back muscles
#3 Prepare your family. As mentioned elsewhere on this site, learning Paintless Dent Repair takes a commitment to practice regularly after training for 2 to 3 months. It really helps if your family is ready to support you, and realizes that your free time will be limited for a while.
What is the best type of reflection system to use for Paintless dent repair training?
In paintless dent repair we use a reflection on the surface of the panel to show us information about the dent, where our tool tip is, and how to fix the dent. The most important thing to have while your learning PDR is the right reflection for your eyes. There are many types of reflections such as fogs, lines, bare bulb, natural reflections, etc. Each of these reflection types have advantages and disadvantages for each individual tech. Also, each of these types have several variations. For example, we use 44 different fog variations when we are dialing in a student who needs a fog board, so we can find the perfect reflection for that student.
So which reflection method is the best? The answer is, there is NO BEST REFLECTION. What works for one tech may often not work for another because everyone sees things differently. So how do you find the reflection that works best for you? The only way is to experiment with every type to determine what is best for you. It also greatly helps to have someone experienced in using all types of reflections to guide you through this process. Most techs end up with a combination of two reflection types that works best for them in most situations. There are also times when a tech may need to use two or more reflections to see everything they need to see to get a quality repair.
Unfortunately almost all trainers will teach with the relection that they use. If you don't see the same things the trainer sees with his reflection, you can be in for a very frustrating experience. At TopGun this is one of our specialities. We take the time and effort necessary to find you the reflection, or combination of reflections that work best for you. So when you hear a PDR trainer say that the reflection he uses is the best one out there, and is the only one you should use, this is not a good sign of a competent trainer. What can be even more confusing is using a fog that is borderline for your eyes. This is because you can see enough visual information to fix most dents, but not enough information to do a clean and fast repair. This is a very common problem with many newer techs who were ony exposed to one reflection type during training.
In addition you must know how to adjust the reflection that is best for you to get the most visual information from it. Many techs use a good reflection for their eyes, but never really see all that it can show them because they don't know the fine points of how to adjust and use it. A good trainer will know the fine points of every type of reflection so he can help any student to find his perfect reflection.
The single most important tool is the right reflection for your eyes because you can't fix what you can't see. Techs using the wrong or borderline reflection to repair dents is probably the #1 reason many techs do poor quality work.
Common eye problems you need to know about
by Marty Runik 5 / 28 / 2011
Any techs knows that PDR is a highly visual art. Most good techs have trained their eyes to see the small subtleties in the reflection, and are easily able to see their tool tip in any size, type, or depth of dent long before they makes an over push. The bottom of the dent or crease should appear clear, very detailed, and show you exactly where to make every push. If you need to over push the bottom of your dent to see your tip, that may just be the first sign that something is wrong. The most common problems are:
#1 Some visual problem that needs attention. (a lot more common than you might think)
#2 Using the wrong reflection for your eyes (even more common than visual problems)
#3 Not understanding how to properly use the reflection.
#4 A learning or processing disability.
In the next few articles we will be discussing the various reasons that beginners and even some seasoned techs sometimes have trouble seeing their work clearly or finding their tip quick enough. We’ll start with the foundational problems and work from there.
It’s always surprising to see how many techs pay little or no attention to their eye health. Part of the reason for this is that most eye problems creep up on us so slowly, that we don’t notice them until they become major issues. Even if the problem doesn’t become a major hindrance, you may have a minor issue that is keeping you from producing as well as you could. Very often once a tech gets these problems corrected, he will notice his speed and quality have improved dramatically, and sometimes very dramatically! Isn’t it funny how we techs will spend all kinds of money on tools, lighting systems etc, but the most basic tool of all….our eyesight is barely given a second thought? Most techs think a trip to the family optometrist every ten years is good enough. Actually for people doing what we do an Ophthalmologist is a much better choice. An Ophthalmologist is a doctor that specializes in all eye disorders, and will catch problems that optometrists aren’t trained or equipped to diagnose. An exam every three years is recommended and only makes common sense when you think about how your ability to make a living is so dependent on healthy eyes.
Let me give a couple of quick examples. A 14 year hail tech noticed he was frequently having to darken the reflection he had used for years. He told me he had to slow down a lot just to see what he always saw easily inside his dent just a couple years ago. He was also having mild headaches and was getting dizzy spells that were getting worse. He went to his optometrist and was told that this was just age related and related to the strain he was putting on his eyes due to his trade. The optometrist prescribed a slightly different contact lens and sent him on his way. He finally saw an Ophthalmologist a few months later, and found out he had a fairly common bacterial infection in both eyes and had probably had it for a few years. After over a month of specialized antibiotics his vision had greatly improved, and most of his speed and quality returned over a four month period. His headaches and dizziness also disappeared. However the bacteria did permanent damage to one eye, fortunately not enough to make much of a difference to his work.
Another recent example was a tech that wanted to start a career in PDR. He got an exam from an Ophthalmologist and was told he had above average eyesight, but that he had a permanent condition that made it very difficult to distinguish light intensity changes. There are many eye disorders that can cause this same symptom and can sometimes account for why some techs can’t use any type of traditional fog reflection. This made it necessary for him to learn from a line board or natural reflection exclusively, as he could not process what happens with a fog or tube light reflection.
One more example. Some years ago an older tech noticed his ability to focus was deteriorating. He was also getting mild eye strain headaches. An Ophthalmological exam determined that his problem was age related but more severe than normal. He was given specific eye exercises to do along with supplements. It took about 8 months, but his ability to focus improved so much he was able to work 10 hour days whereas before he was lucky to work 6 or 7 before his eyes gave out. The headaches also improved because the eye strain was so relieved.
These are just some of many examples I’ve seen from many techs. I personally have fought a battle with my eyesight for many years since I hit 51. I know several techs in a similar situation. Without the help of my Ophthalmologist I would probably not be able to do dent work today. I’ll be hitting 60 soon, and I certainly want to make sure I can do this for as long as possible. The exercises I do everyday don’t take that long and I always notice a difference when I get lazy and don’t do them for a couple weeks.
Unfortunately some conditions can’t be cured ore even improved. But the vast majority can be vastly improved or totally cleared up once you know what is really causing the problem and get the right treatment. The important thing is to find out exactly what is going on as soon as possible. The longer most vision problems exist, the more permanent damage will result. DON’T WAIT until you have a problem to get examined. Fixing a problem before it becomes noticeable is a lot easier to treat than waiting until you notice something wrong.
Now there can be a big difference in the quality of care between Ophthalmologists. Don’t necessarily go for the cheapest price. Do your research and find the doctor that gets the best reviews. Make sure the doctor you choose takes a broad approach to treatment including eye exercises, supplements, etc, and doesn’t just prescribe drugs or corrective lenses. Unfortunately, many doctors are taking a “care by the numbers” or mostly prescribing drugs approach to treatment. We all know there is a big difference between a quality PDR tech and an adequate one right? Well there is also a definite difference in Ophthalmologists. It may take some time to find one in your area that takes a broad quality approach, but its more than worth the effort if you value your most important money making tool…your eyes!
NO MATTER WHAT I DO I CAN'T SEE MY TOOL TIP WHATS WRONG WITH ME?
by Marty Runik 7/30/2011
Any experienced tech knows there is nothing that will screw up a dent worse than not seeing your tip until its too late. If there are even a couple bad over pushes in your dent, especially in the sweet spot, ( impact point ) the chances of a true 100% finish or even a fast repair are gone. But what if you know your eyesight is fine or is corrected to as good as its going to get, and you still can’t see your tip before making over pushes inside your deeper dents and creases? The next step is usually determining if you are using the right reflection type for your eyes and brain. This may get a bit technical but we’ll try and keep things as simple as possible.
Believe it or not, the way your brain processes visual information has more to do with the type of reflection you need than you eyes do. Two people with identical vision in every way may still need two completely different reflection types. A good example of this is the old fight between techs that like a traditional fog board vs. those that use a line board. A line board tech may ONLY be able to use a line board because his brain will not process what are called analog visual signals, but he can easily process digital information. Such a tech can spend years trying to see things in a fog board that his brain will never allow him to see. I’ve found that about 2-3% of techs absolutely need a line board to get the best visual info for them. On the other hand, a person whose brain can not process digital info but only sees analog information will never see a thing in a line board no matter how much time he spends working with it. Such a tech will need some type of fog reflection or possibly a hybrid fog to see the visual info he needs.
Now most people can process both types of visual info, but will tend to be more analog visually. These people can use either reflection but will usually see best from some type of fog reflection. If this person is more over on the digital side of the scale though, he will do best with a combination board made of a wide hard line stripe with just a small fog on both edges of the line.
So how do you know which type you are? Its fairly easy to find out.
#1 If looking at a properly adjusted standard fog reflection in a panel does not show you variations of shading from dark to light grey in and around the dent, and you don’t see these shades change as you move the board or your head slightly, then chances are you will need a line board or straight fluorescent reflection. Also, if you do not see a gradual fade in the fogged area of the reflection board itself, but instead see a fuzzy thick line or even a hard line, then a fog reflection probably will not work for you.
If you fall into this category, a video on how to read a line board, or some personal instruction should very quickly make things click for you. You will probably feel a line board just makes perfect sense to you and you almost intuitively know what your looking at with just a little instruction.
#2 If looking at a line board any more than 5 minutes gives you a headache, makes you slightly dizzy, feel something like a buzzing in your head, or in extreme cases makes you feel like throwing up, you are almost entirely an analog person. You will need some type of fog reflection, and will probably never be able to use a line board. One notable exception to this is in extreme cases such as heavy UV damage to the eye from too much arc welding or long term sun exposure. This type of tech, even though he would probably benefit from some type of standard fog may need a bright fluorescent light type of fog or even a straight fluorescent tube light with no fog at all. This would be a bright hard edge reflection. But even in this extreme case, the tech will not be able to use a line board successfully.
#3 If looking at a line board for a while only confuses you, or you don’t know what your looking at you are probably both analog and digital and just need to understand the line reflection better to use it. This is BY FAR the most common type of tech. In my opinion this tech will usually benefit most from some type of fog reflection. For these techs, a line reflection does have some limited uses which we will discuss in a future article.
Again, in my opinion most techs can learn to use some type of fog. There are MANY different types out there now, and I think this reflection type will show the most detail and visual information to techs that can use it. But what about those techs who know their eyes are fine and who have been trained with every reflection out there and still don’t feel like they see things the way they should. Don’t give up until you find some one who knows the visual side of a technique called Brain Gym. You can find these specialists in almost every part of the country now as the techniques are gaining in popularity rapidly. If you bring the different types of reflections to these people they can test you and give you certain exercises that will help you determine which reflection works best for your brain and eyes together.
Of course sometimes no matter what any one does there are some people that despite all efforts, who seemingly should be good candidates for this trade, still can not learn PDR. Brain Gym is not 100% effective for some people. But with this technique, you will almost always know immediately if you have a problem that can be helped or not. If this sounds like you, you can save months of agony and wasted money by looking up one of these specialists first.
There are other possible causes of not being able to make sense of any reflection. Most of these are more obvious though. Learning or processing disabilities are by far the most common.. If you have been diagnosed with an input or output category type of learning problem, PDR will be extremely difficult or even impossible for you to learn. If you were diagnosed with problems in the integration or storage category you should still be able to learn PDR but at a slower pace. Other problems such as dyslexia, ADD, etc can be worked with to a point. Past head or eye trauma can also make PDR a bad fit for you. If you even suspect something like a disability is hindering your progress, you will of course want to get examined by a specialist before going any further.
Fog Basics
by Marty Runik 10/18/2011
In the last article we discussed the basics of determining which type of reflection might work best for you. Now we are ready to discuss the basics of each reflection and their strengths and weaknesses. We will start with a fog type reflection.
There are many types of fog reflections. Some of the most common are a painted fog, shadow fog, natural fog, LED fog, and colored contrast fog. A fog reflection has several advantages. It is currently the only reflection type that will give a 3D view, a mirror image view, and a simple overhead view of any dent. Just by moving your head through the reflection in the panel you can get all of these views simultaneously. When I say a 3D view I mean that you can see a dent as though it were a 3D image with depth and contrast somewhat like you see in a 3D movie. This enables you to easily see the deepest part of your dent or crease along with seeing the relative depth of any high spots and be able to easily tell which of these areas needs to be repaired first. This characteristic is extremely useful when it comes to releasing pressure in a dent in the right sequence because you can easily compare the height or depth of any damage inside or outside the dent and know what order to repair it in for the fastest and cleanest repair.
When we talk about a mirror image of the dent we mean the ability to see a reverse image of the dent or crease just by slightly moving your head through the reflection in the panel. This comes in useful especially on deeper or more complex damage. Being able to see this mirror image will many times enable you to see around a bad reflection spot or bounced reflection inside a dent. This is a very common trouble spot with techs on larger dents. This mirror image can also help you to see your sweet spot or impact point better on deeper dents, because you can get a 180 degree different view of the dent by using this mirror image effect. Small high or low spots that can sometimes hide in the reflection can be brought out very well using this mirror image from a fog reflection.
The overhead view means being able to see a very simple top view of the dent without having it complicated by lines, edges, or other things in many other reflection types. The top view of a fog will show you the important basics of the damage and will illuminate the sweet spot (impact point) more clearly than any other reflection type, especially on deeper dents.
Using all three of these views at the same time during the dent repair makes it very easy to see not just your tool tip, but will always clearly show you the right sequence to push the dent. These views used together will also show you clearly when you are about to make an over push or show you if you even start to make a corn row because you see so much information at once. Sometimes when starting to use a fog something like information over load will happen because you see so much visual information it can be over whelming for some one who is just getting started using a fog reflection.
When doing deeper dents some fogs can be adjusted wider so you don’t get the back shadow effect a tech will notice on most standard fogs. On many fog reflections, light can bounce back and forth at the bottom of deeper dents creating very confusing effects such as circles or strange visual effects instead of a simple light and dark shade at the bottom. Fogs that can be adjusted wider will compensate for this effect and give you a nice simple look at the dent, even at the very bottom of a deep damage such as a BB gun dent or very deep crease. Another nice thing about these adjustable fogs is that they can be narrowed down to a single thin fog that many techs prefer to finish a dent. For many techs, using these fog lights will show a wider variety of information than a standard fog.
Now it sounds like a fog has lots of advantages and no short comings for those techs that can use them. Unfortunately this isn’t true. A fogs major disadvantage is that it is VERY sensitive as to how it is adjusted. In fact a fog that is not adjusted right or is out of its visual range or “sweet spot” may confuse a tech more than it will help him. Also on horizontal damage, the fog is even harder to adjust properly because the fog reflection gets tighter (thinner) and you loose some visual information if it isn’t adjusted right on. This is why many techs use a hybrid reflection made up of a fog and a line at the edge of a reflection board to show things when working horizontally that a fog may not show well. This is mostly because you can’t adjust any reflection board past the floor when looking for some types of horizontal damage, and this means you may not be able to get a fog board back far enough too see well in these situations.
Some techs can see deep damage and fix it with a fog but can not finish with a fog no matter what they do. This isn’t due to not understanding a fog, but an inability to see the minor subtleties in a fog at the finish stage. Many techs with this problem use a shadow caster type reflection so they can get a fog and bright bulb hard line to see and work the finish.
Many techs have tried a few fog boards and conclude that a fog isn’t right for them. Before making such a decision, remember that the vast majority of techs can see well from some type of fog. Before giving up, make sure you try as many different fog types as you can. With all the different fog reflections available to a PDR tech today, there should be at least one out there that will work for you. A fog reflection is far too valuable a tool to give up on before trying everything out there. Remember, finding the perfect reflection for you is by far the most important thing you can do in PDR. You can’t fix what you can’t see!
General Retail Sales Technique part 1
by Marty Runik 1/22/2012
I’ve been getting a lot of questions on retail marketing for PDR lately. Most of this interest seems to be coming from long time techs. With the economy hitting dealerships hard in most areas, retail PDR is starting to get the attention it deserves. We will be doing a series here on effective sales and marketing techniques. But as always we need to start with the basics. Most of the time PDR sells itself to retail customers. But you will need at least moderate marketing and sales skills to sell to insurance agents, body shops, office parks, etc. Here is a list of sales basics as they relate to PDR.
#1 How to deal with Rejection. NEVER take it personally! Taking rejection personally can be the beginning of the end for any retail business. Unless you make sales with holes in your pants and a runny nose (don’t laugh I saw a PDR tech do this), they probably aren’t rejecting you. We all have off days and your potential customer may be having one as well. Also, the customer may not have the money or need your services at that time. If you present yourself well, a customer rarely says no because of you. All this is very important to keep in mind, because the temptation after getting told no a few times is to take it personally. Then your confidence goes quickly, and your lack of confidence will be noticed by most customers. Learn from these rejections, and refine your sales approach. Many times todays rejection is next months sale. Follow up in a month or two, unless you know it is a lost cause.
You may even find your customers will help you refine your sales approach. You should always try and “scratch where the customer itches”. If you find yourself loosing too many sales, chances are your customers will tell you where you lost it if you ask them. Many sales are not lost on price issues, but on the customers “gut feeling” that they don’t trust you, or your abilities. Listen to their feedback no matter how it may bother or even hurt you. If you keep getting the same negative feedback, you need to change your approach whether you think you do or not! Getting the customers trust is the hard part, because they have been screwed over so many times as we all have. Once you have their trust, the sale is easy
Many times there is a power play or control issue going on with people, especially those in most automotive related businesses. They feel they need to control the situation or they will get screwed. Never argue or get impatient with them. Let them know that you understand that it is of course their choice whether to use you or not, and ask if there would be a better time for them to talk about your service. This will usually diffuse a “who is in control” situation. With many of these people you need to realize it’s not you, it’s the world they’re mad at.
#2 Exude confidence but NOT arrogance. Assuming you are at the skill level needed for this, go in confident of your skill level and let it show a little. However, many techs make the mistake of being arrogant without even realizing it until their wife or another female points this out to them. Most women have a real knack of recognizing subtleties like this that will go right past most men. Run your sales material and sales approach past a few women and ask them what impression you are giving.
#3 Always be honest with clients. If you make a mistake, don’t let the customer find it, you need to tell him yourself. This is always embarrassing, but you will usually find people are so surprised at your honesty and willingness to make it right that they will want to use you again because they know they can trust you now. Never raise your agreed on price, even if you have to eat it a little. If your not confident you can do the job tell them it is beyond your present ability or that it can’t be done with PDR. That old saying “always under promise and over deliver” always holds true especially in PDR. When a job goes bad, don’t panic. Explain to the customer that the dent had more damaged than you thought, and you could not get it out all the way. Of course you don’t want to charge for the work in these situations. Most customers will be grateful that you tried.
#4 Eliminate objections to using your service before they happen. Dings and small dents are not a necessity for most customers, it is only a vanity and convenience issue for them. You MUST make the service you offer very easy for the customer to use. If you don’t take credit cards, do so. This will eliminate many payment issue problems, and they are a great up-selling tool. Try and offer mobile service. Many potential customers don’t have the time to bring the vehicle to you. Do your best to accommodate their schedule within reason. Always try and give the customer at least an hours notice before you will arrive. Call the night before to confirm the appointment.
#5 Don’t give free mobile estimates. In most cases these are huge time wasters. If a job sounds promising, tell a customer you may be able look at it when you are in the area next. Or they can bring it to you for a free estimate. Taking digital photos and e-mailing them to you is another way of giving estimates. Make sure to tell the customer to take the pictures at an angle and from a distance around 10 feet, and from two different 180 degree angles.
#6 Have the name of a couple good mobile painters / body shops to give to customers that need it. It is good customer service, and a good way of getting a referral network going with the other businesses. It also may come in handy if you damage the paint on a customers car and need help in a hurry.
#7 Try and get along with as many dent techs in your area as possible. The competition among PDR techs in the same location is of course pretty fierce. But you should be able to find at least a couple other quality minded techs that you can get along with in your area. When you are swamped with work and need help, there is nothing like another trusted tech in your area to help you out. It makes taking vacations easier also if you can refer calls to them.
#8 If you haven’t named your business yet, consider using a name with Dent as the first word. There are many reasons why large dent companies have dent as the first word in their names and they are all about marketing and name recognition. As an example, many people find services in the white pages listings instead of the yellow pages. This is especially true for PDR since there is no PDR listing in yellow pages. PDR advertisers get dumped in the auto body section. A customer looking for PDR services will usually look for DENT in the white pages and if your name doesn’t start with dent they won’t find you. The white page listing is free, and a bold listing in the white pages is very cheap and should get you at least a few calls a month.
#9 Have fun. You should enjoy doing retail PDR. Customers will pick up on your attitude quickly, and a person that enjoys their work will always make a positive impression. One of the great things about retail is the mindset you develop from all the compliments you get. A VERY welcome change from wholesale work! Let the customer know how much you appreciate the kind words, and that it was a pleasure serving them…even if it wasn’t
Next time we will continue with part two of Sales basics for PDR.